OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

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richmond62
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OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by richmond62 »

It works on my MacOS Monterey machine without any problems at all.
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tperry2x
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OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

richmond62 wrote: Mon Jun 17, 2024 12:41 pm It works on my MacOS Monterey machine without any problems at all.
That's good. I can't see any extra special code completion at all in 8.2.0 DP2, which is unfortunate.

I found an article here:
https://www.livecode-blog.de/2017/09/13 ... ter-blick/
(Translated to English - Thanks Firefox, and attached).
However, I can't seem to get that to work, even though it would appear that autocomplete is most definitely on.
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Ho hum, doesn't stop me making my retro edition though - so will carry on with that when I have more time later.
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OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

Actually, just to come back on this point:
richmond62 wrote: Mon Jun 17, 2024 12:41 pm It works on my MacOS Monterey machine without any problems at all.
I'm assuming that means 8.2.0 dp2 is a 'fat binary', with both 32-bit and 64-bit platform support?
As you know, OSX 10.6 is 32-bit only, but 8.2.0 dp2 runs fine on there. However, if I take something that is absolutely 64-bit (Like the built-in "Font Book.app") from OSX 10.9, you'll see it's not got a chance of running being 64-bit.
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OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

This should have been it's own thread really. I'll probably move it into it's own 'Retro' build thread. (edit, done)
Anyway, it's coming along slowly...
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by richmond62 »

'Things' changed, and I was able to go through those othet backup disks: to no avail I am afraid.
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

richmond62 wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2024 12:41 pm 'Things' changed, and I was able to go through those othet backup disks: to no avail I am afraid.
No problem. I'll just keep plugging away on this 10.6 mac. It's not as fast as it once was (or perhaps my expectations have become loftier, who knows).
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by richmond62 »

I have been down in the dungeon of a serious pile of old hard drives:

Linux installers for LC 8.2.0 DP2 have been uploaded to your 'stash'.

I have also uploaded ALL the LC 8.2.0 DP2 installers to the internet archive:

https://archive.org/details/live-code-c ... 0-dp-2-mac
-
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by richmond62 »

AND I would jalouse that under the Open Source licence thingy, were you to request the source code from the people who made these items they would be obliged to supply you with it.
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by richmond62 »

sandsOFTime.jpg
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-
As that pictures shows about half of my backup disks, all I can say is that I REALLY am getting old. 8-)

Oh, and the deodorant . . . well you try going through that many old hard drives . . . :lol:
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

Thank you Richmond. This is hugely appreciated, (downloaded and will keep a copy of those), because that 10.6 mac is really slow. I can use it for testing / verification, but far better to be able to make those changes in a modern linux and transpose over to the Mac when ready.

Once again, thank you for your efforts (and some serious file retrieval).
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by richmond62 »

Interesting stuff:

https://github.com/livecode/livecode-id ... ate=closed

I don't know if there is a way to download source code associated with a milestone.

https://livecode.com/new-autocomplete-l ... ecode-8-2/
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

There is, but it would need compiling. And therein lies the problem. I could probably get this to compile in Linux, but still have the problems in MacOS and Windows that are still issues.

The option to show Live-errors are already available in the engine:
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What isn't clear from that link, is that Autocomplete seems to be only part of "LiveCode Community Plus" and Autocomplete Pro part of "LiveCode Commercial"

It's all still in the home stack, but forcefully enabling it *might* be a no-no?

Code: Select all

return "communityplus"
   case "autocomplete"
      return true
   case "autocomplete_pro"
      return false

case "indy"
   case "autocomplete"
      return true
   case "autocomplete_pro"
      return false

case "commercial"
   case "autocomplete"
   case "autocomplete_pro"
      return true
Okay, I've simplified that a lot - but this seems to be how they are turning bits on and off depending on the different editions.

If so, it loads them with:

Code: Select all

 if revEnvironmentEditionProperty("autocomplete_pro") then
         put return & "autocomplete-pro" after tLoadList
      end if
      
      if revEnvironmentEditionProperty("autocomplete") then
         put return & "autocomplete" after tLoadList
      end if
To be clear, this is in the 9.x series we are using on our 'modern' (?) editions. (okay, new-to-us editions of the engine).
There's probably more to it than that. There's probably a stack / plugin / extension that isn't included in the community edition deliberately.

I mean, it's not as simple as:

Code: Select all

on mousedown
   put "autocomplete_pro" & return & "autocomplete" into tLoadList
   repeat for each line tLib in tLoadList	 
      revInternal__Log "Message", "Loading library" && tLib	
      revInternal__LoadLibrary tLib
      if the result is not empty then
         revInternal__Log "Error", the result 
      end if
   end repeat
end mousedown
Which I'd hoped it would be. Doesn't produce any errors though.
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by OpenXTalkPaul »

OSX 10.6 is 32-bit only
No SnowLeopard supported both Intel 32 bit and 64bit binaries, plug-ins, kernel extensions, etc. They dropped PowerPC support (after initial 10.6 betas that had it).

Here's the thread about the LC v8 compatible Color SVG widget, which I guess was declared obsolete after color SVG viewing support was added to the image controls, even though the functionality is quite different.
https://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.p ... 30#p154437

And here's some links about early SVG Color development efforts from LC Team:
https://github.com/livecode/livecode/pull/3089
Including prototype Color SVG widget here:
https://github.com/livecode/livecode/pu ... b94e8591c3

https://github.com/livecode/livecode/pull/6099
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

OpenXTalkPaul wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2024 10:19 pm
OSX 10.6 is 32-bit only
No SnowLeopard supported both Intel 32 bit and 64bit binaries, plug-ins, kernel extensions, etc.
Actually yes, and also no.
I should clarify. It's down to processor too.
If you are running 10.6 on an intel Core Solo or Core Duo (like I'm doing here) it can only run 32-bit applications. The OS loads a 32 bit Kernel if it detects those processors. This is why I copied that 64 bit program from another MacOS to show I'm on a 32 bit only kernel, and that 64 bit apps (at least for me on this old Mac) can't be opened.
OpenXTalkPaul wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2024 10:19 pm They dropped PowerPC support (after initial 10.6 betas that had it).
Also interesting, as I have PowerPC applications on that which open and run (not universal PPC and Intel binaries, but PPC only) that run, despite it being MacOS 10.6.8

This is because the first time I opened a PPC app on it, an alert popped up saying "Additional software is required to run PowerPC applications. To run this software you need to install Rosetta. Would you like to download and install Rosetta now?". Which I said yes to. So I can confirm that 10.6.8 can indeed run PPC applications through a Rosetta v1 layer. Just like Rosetta v2 runs x64 intel ones currently on Apple Arm chips.
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by OpenXTalkPaul »

tperry2x wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2024 10:32 pm This is because the first time I opened a PPC app on it, an alert popped up saying "Additional software is required to run PowerPC applications. To run this software you need to install Rosetta. Would you like to download and install Rosetta now?". Which I said yes to. So I can confirm that 10.6.8 can indeed run PPC applications through a Rosetta v1 layer. Just like Rosetta v2 runs x64 intel ones currently on Apple Arm chips.
Oh right, SnowLeo still had Rosetta 1 PPC->Intel instruction set translator available, what I meant was a PowerPC Macs couldn't boot up the OS (except for early 'OS X Server' edition beta). SnowLeo could run software built targeting three different CPUs (PPC32, X86, X86-64) which is one reason I stuck with that version so long. It rocked! I know some commercial printers stuck with that version for an extended time period. It was also the last version to support AppleTalk so if you had an aging expensive Imagesetter or similar device with built-in AppleTalk support that was a strong reason not to upgrade.
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

Just thought I'd let you know it's coming along.
It's a slower process than you might think, but it's getting there.
Not everything is implemented yet. I'm in the process of going through everything, verifying things work as they should...
Already got the dictionary, the user guides, the PDFs from TerryL, the About dialogs, and a few other bits carefully spliced in.
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by OpenXTalkPaul »

Very cool, I'll be updating my SnowLeo rig with this version. Thanks!
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by richmond62 »

Am I correct in assuming that the OXT Lite Retro (and there's a mouthful in its own right) will ONLY feature the capabilities of LC 8.1.10/8.2, so will not cope with importing SVG vector images?
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

That is one of the drawbacks of using an older engine.
The other drawback is it's kind of retro-fitting it with the fixes we've made in OXT, and it does not like some of them - because the engine underneath doesn't support it.

My plan-b to that would be to produce a CD/DVD iso that you could boot into, replacing the MacOs (thereby allowing for a newer 9.7.1 engine), but I do want to provide a version of OXT lite that will run on OSX 10.6 ideally. It's just slow going, that's all...
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Re: OpenXTalk Lite Retro Edition...

Post by tperry2x »

Draft version of OpenXTalk Lite "Retro" (download link here)
Suitable for MacOS 10.6.8 (32-bit capable, universal fat binary) using the 8.2.0 dp2 engine. (should run on MacOS versions up to and including MacOS 10.14 - possibly even beyond) - only tested on MacOS 10.6.8 through to MacOS 10.9.x so far. This is intended for older macs with intel processors of some description. Not for PPC processors.

Please launch the 'Run this first' before you run the program. The reason why is explained in the "Read Me"
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